grip
Advanced Member
Posts: 2,826
|
Post by grip on Dec 2, 2017 15:07:05 GMT
Hi All,
sat
Just had my PC die on me, not sure what the problem is most likely to be. It stopped working whilst running and me sat away from it. When trying to boot it
I'm not seeing any boot menu, no audible activity from any of the disks (although slight vibration is evident to touch).
I have recently had a couple of "out of memory" messages" rebooted and all was OK.
I recently had to replace my graphics card as the previous one was giving corrupt graphics.
Obviously this old bl**der hasn't been taking any notice of the warning signs.....My biggest worry is HD failure as I'm not to well backed up, but I'm hoping as there is no boot up menu or "disk not found" message that the disks maybe OK.
If I replace the motherboard, I'm likely to have to purchase a new windows 10 licence as I believe it's paired to the machine its first installed on.
Question 1: Could a memory failure prevent the boot up message and the Ma board still be OK?
Kind regards,
Chris
p.s. I hate this lappy keyboard
|
|
duncan
Mature Member
Posts: 357 
|
Post by duncan on Dec 2, 2017 15:13:32 GMT
Hi Chris. It points to a memory fault. If you have two memory sticks, try taking one out and see if it works. Do the same with the other one.
Duncan.
|
|
|
|
Post by Foot Tapper on Dec 2, 2017 17:06:16 GMT
Not showing any lights would indicate a (PSU)power supply unit fault the viberation
could possibly be than fan running wether in the PSU or the one directly over the
micro processor some have one and others have both fans, over heating of the PSU
will cause it to shut down switching it of for quite a reasonable amount of time to let
it completely cool down and even removing the Battery Back Up unit from the Laptop
if you can acces it wait a while then refit the BBU power up then see what happens on
a boot up if it goes to the start upscreen if after that your sure everything is working
ok leave it if it shuts down again while just sat there then feel if it's got HOT you can get
a jist of things by sometimes just waiting and seeing without starting to pull things
apart.Remember everything is power related nothing works without having a power
source one way or another,the Hard disk is general supported by its own internal
power source but the display/keyboards etc. are supported by the PSU so as you
power it all on it comes to life and when you switch it off the data on the (NVR)
non volatile ram memory stored on the HD As explained below:
Non-volatile random-access memory (NVRAM) is random-access memory that retains its information when power is turned off (non-volatile). This is in contrast to dynamic random-access memory (DRAM) and static random-access memory (SRAM), which both maintain data only for as long as power is applied.
Sounds a lot of mumbo jumbo but basically it is only down to logic and there is no need to bang
your head against a brick wall or go round swearing and cursing try always to think logically and
most things are solvable in the long run and another thing think lucky,Luck can sometimes
play a part in things if after all this it works pour yourself a drink of your choice and put your
feet up and listen to some quality guitar music
Hope this makes you smile even if it doesn't solve it
Pete
|
|
grip
Advanced Member
Posts: 2,826
|
Post by grip on Dec 2, 2017 18:52:11 GMT
Hi Chris. It points to a memory fault. If you have two memory sticks, try taking one out and see if it works. Do the same with the other one. Duncan. Hi Duncan, Thanks for your input, Ihope that this is the case, a further problem is that there is no idication of type of memory - DDR3 I think, but haven't a clue as to it's speed, or any info on the Ma board to give an indication. Hi Pete, Thanks for your input, over-heating is not the problem in this instace, I have a massive fan and water CPU cooling, a well oversized PSU and I vacuum all the reachable dust out at least 4 times a year...I have had a fried CPU quite a few years ago. It's not a laptop, it's a desktop, my comment regarding the keyboard on the lappy is because I have a nice tactile keyboard on my Desktop  so no battery backup. It's not munbo jumbo Pete, I have been building my own PC's for many years and had to mess around to install a maths co-processor and a hard drive in my first ever PC a Dixons twin floppy drive(20 MB's and cost £240 second hand) in the days where you had to write your own config sys and autoexec.bat files to suit what was on your PC 20 MB's to be able to install AutoCAD in 1989....the problem is my memory as much as PC memory. Kind regards, Chris |
|
|
|
Post by Foot Tapper on Dec 2, 2017 19:10:07 GMT
Hi Chris. It points to a memory fault. If you have two memory sticks, try taking one out and see if it works. Do the same with the other one. Duncan. It's not munbo jumbo Pete, I have been building my own PC's for many years and had to mess around to install a maths co-processor and a hard drive in my first ever PC a Dixons twin floppy drive(20 MB's and cost £240 second hand) in the days where you had to write your own config sys and autoexec.bat files to suit what was on your PC 20 MB's and cost £240 second hand to be able to install AutoCAD in 1989....the problem is my memory as much as PC memory. Kind regards, Chris Sorry Chris what I meant to say was what I had said was mumbo jumbo and not anything else. |
|
grip
Advanced Member
Posts: 2,826
|
Post by grip on Dec 3, 2017 12:50:55 GMT
Hi All,
Something else occurred to me that it could be is the cmos battery being dead, I couln't see exactly where it was for wires expansion cards and things and I'll look at that if trying good memory doesn't work before committing to a new mother-board. It's entirely the wrong time of the year for unplanned spending. I could get by for a while without my PC, I've not tried putting my presonus interface through the laptop yet, but may have to try going that route for a while.
Kind regards,
Chris
|
|
duncan
Mature Member
Posts: 357
|
Post by duncan on Dec 3, 2017 13:22:22 GMT
Take one memory stick out, and try booting up. if it doesn't boot, put that stick back in and do the same with the other one. if it still wont boot, look for the clear CMOS pins on the mb and short them out with a screwdriver.
That will force it to re-load the bios.
Duncan.
|
|
grip
Advanced Member
Posts: 2,826
|
Post by grip on Dec 3, 2017 13:45:40 GMT
Take one memory stick out, and try booting up. if it doesn't boot, put that stick back in and do the same with the other one. if it still wont boot, look for the clear CMOS pins on the mb and short them out with a screwdriver. That will force it to re-load the bios. Duncan. Hi Duncan, Many thanks for the suggestions. I would try both, but I only have 1 stick of 8GB DD3 memory, and I can't get to the jumper to clear cmos, so I have had an offer from a god member of this forum to let me borrow some DDR3 memory, and that is my first port of call to test with new mwmory. I'll not say who, as the offer was made by pm....got to dig out my earthing wrist strap now Kind regards, Chris |
|
|
|
Post by guitarphil on Dec 3, 2017 22:17:34 GMT
When my Win10 PC refused to start recently it turned out to be one of the RAM modules was faulty. My PC was built by Chillblast and with the help of their support I was able to work through some suggestions including the clear CMOS trick etc and locate the faulty ram module. (The PC started up when the bad module was removed). The original modules were by Crucial and it seemed they no longer manufactured the exact type I needed but, by contacting their very helpful support I was able to get an alternative. Even better it was supplied free because apparently they come with a lifetime warranty.  Top marks to Crucial for customer service. Phil. |
|
grip
Advanced Member
Posts: 2,826
|
Post by grip on Dec 4, 2017 11:34:35 GMT
When my Win10 PC refused to start recently it turned out to be one of the RAM modules was faulty. My PC was built by Chillblast and with the help of their support I was able to work through some suggestions including the clear CMOS trick etc and locate the faulty ram module. (The PC started up when the bad module was removed). The original modules were by Crucial and it seemed they no longer manufactured the exact type I needed but, by contacting their very helpful support I was able to get an alternative. Even better it was supplied free because apparently they come with a lifetime warranty. Top marks to Crucial for customer service. Phil. Thanks for that info Phil, it gives me quite a bit of confidence that my problem may just be that of the memory. I'll leave well alone until the postie pops the memory through the dood that I'm being so kindly lent. Kind regards, Chris |
|
|
|
Post by wedgehog on Dec 4, 2017 17:40:18 GMT
Hi Chris, I don't know how much further you have gone with this but I thought I would just mention that the kind of fault that you are describing can also be caused by bad capacitors on the MB, usually the large ones around the main Proc. area. Some of the ones used by various manufacturers really are crap, and if it's a MB that has seen a few years service and the caps are a problem, replacing them is not a job for a novice. Let us know how you go.
|
|
grip
Advanced Member
Posts: 2,826
|
Post by grip on Dec 4, 2017 22:17:24 GMT
Hi Chris, I don't know how much further you have gone with this but I thought I would just mention that the kind of fault that you are describing can also be caused by bad capacitors on the MB, usually the large ones around the main Proc. area. Some of the ones used by various manufacturers really are crap, and if it's a MB that has seen a few years service and the caps are a problem, replacing them is not a job for a novice. Let us know how you go. Hi Bob, Welcome to the site, it's always nice to see new members.  Many thanks for your input wedgehog, if the problem isn't the memory, then I'll replace the MB as it's been in use for most of the day for a number of years now, there are probably a number of components approaching failure toward the end of the MB's useful life, and stretching my soldering capabilities a bit as it's probably a multi layer PCB. Kind regards, Chris |
|
|
|
Post by Foot Tapper on Dec 5, 2017 11:01:20 GMT
Well Chris
Now you have me intrigued what's happening with this ongoing problem
with things,did you manage to clear the cmos ram if I remember I think
a small amount of memory is retained on the Motherboard as well
Pete
PS: remember your anti static mat and your dedicated earth wrist strap
when working on a pcb a certain amount of charge is left in the on board
capacitors and may need discharging when I think back to all the years
I worked on systems Happy Days I don't think so.
|
|
|
|
Post by wedgehog on Dec 5, 2017 13:08:46 GMT
Hi Chris, I don't know how much further you have gone with this but I thought I would just mention that the kind of fault that you are describing can also be caused by bad capacitors on the MB, usually the large ones around the main Proc. area. Some of the ones used by various manufacturers really are crap, and if it's a MB that has seen a few years service and the caps are a problem, replacing them is not a job for a novice. Let us know how you go. Hi Bob, Welcome to the site, it's always nice to see new members. Many thanks for your input wedgehog, if the problem isn't the memory, then I'll replace the MB as it's been in use for most of the day for a number of years now, there are probably a number of components approaching failure toward the end of the MB's useful life, and stretching my soldering capabilities a bit as it's probably a multi layer PCB. Kind regards, Chris Thanks for the welcome Chris. Certainly is mate, 8 or 10 layers, it should be plated through, but the problem is getting the negative end hot enough to remove and replace the caps because of the large amounts of copper on the negative planes, it dissipates the heat as fast as you apply it, I have done them in the past, but it's a pig and you are absolutely correct mate, when it get's to this, if it's this, then replacement is the way to go, also a good excuse for an upgrade. |
|
|
|
Post by The Rev Leonard Victor on Dec 5, 2017 17:20:29 GMT
Have you tried bringing a Priest in to bless it Chris? If that doesn't work you could always smack it with a mallet.  |
|
grip
Advanced Member
Posts: 2,826
|
Post by grip on Dec 6, 2017 13:23:18 GMT
Hi all,
Many thanks for your contributions/solutions as to the cause. I has a situation yesterday where I urgently needed to get a password for an account (not bank obviously), and our Postman had passed us by, so had to go and buy an 8GB DIMM memory to see if I could get things up and running. Fortunately it proved to be the memory that was at fault, and my PC is up and running again. I notice my boot up HD is making a lot of noise, so I have to put my hand in my pocket again to get a replacement ASAP.
Many thanks to the kins gentleman that sent me his memory to try, which I received this morning and it will be winging it's way back in tomorrows post.
I was a but miffed as there is a PC World and Maplins both on the same business park not too far from where I live, between them there was only 1 stick of suitable memory available.
As ever the stock answer is "we can get you 1 by tomorrow sir", my stock answer is "so can I, and probably cheaper but as this is a shop I thought I might be able to buy one". It's largely the same with local music shops now too, if they hadn't got something in that I wanted to try, they would get one in without any obligation to buy. Now, they want s deposit and commitment to buy to get one in to try unless it's a line that they normally stock.
Kind regards,
Chris
|
|
|
|
Post by guitarphil on Dec 6, 2017 17:06:03 GMT
That's good news Chris.
You should consider an SSD as the boot HD replacement.
Phil.
|
|
duncan
Mature Member
Posts: 357
|
Post by duncan on Dec 6, 2017 18:37:35 GMT
Hi Chris. Glad you are up and running I did tell you six minutes after your post  Duncan. |
|
|
|
Post by wedgehog on Dec 7, 2017 12:21:04 GMT
That's good news Chris. You should consider an SSD as the boot HD replacement. Phil. Yup, excellent news mate and probably the easiest of the possible repairs. I agree Phil, Put an SSD as my C drive couple of years ago now and it makes the PC lightning fast because the paged memory is now solid state as well. Dpn't do what I did though and try to get away with the smallest cheapest one you can, false economy, you will use it up fast, min around half a TB |
|
grip
Advanced Member
Posts: 2,826
|
Post by grip on Dec 9, 2017 9:13:12 GMT
Hi All, I didn't go down the SSD route, as I wanted to be able to simply clone the disk (3TB). I've got it installed now and the new HDD sounds like a stagecoach going down a cobbled street  It's saving grace is that it is faster (7200rpm vs 5400rpm) I guess you win some and lose some. Kind regards, Chris |
|
|
|
Post by guitarphil on Dec 9, 2017 11:50:59 GMT
Hey Chris, I didn't know you were old enough to know what a stagecoach sounded like  Glad you're PC is back up and running again. Phil |
|
grip
Advanced Member
Posts: 2,826
|
Post by grip on Dec 9, 2017 21:07:10 GMT
Hey Chris, I didn't know you were old enough to know what a stagecoach sounded like Glad you're PC is back up and running again. Phil Hi Phil, I saw one on my Bush 9" B&W Bush TYPE 22 Bakelite surround TV Kind regards, Chris |
|
|
|
Post by guitarphil on Dec 9, 2017 21:21:16 GMT
Ah yes, I remember it well  |
|
|
|
Post by scmitche on Dec 16, 2017 1:36:21 GMT
I think I saw the Coronation on that at my Grandad's house. I was 5 and had flu but they said I had to watch it!!
|
|
so no battery backup. 
